Interview by Tom Kelly

Major expansion plans are in the pipeline for the college, including the provision of eight science laboratories, student accommodation and ultra-modern sporting facilities. Mr. Thorn quashed reports that a sum of £1m. would finish development work at the college.

He explained: "There is quite a bit of debate in the town with a lot of people getting in on the matter. I am anxious to clarify exactly what is happening, so that the public will know what is required over the coming years.

"The situation, as it currently stands, is that we are planning with the Department of Education to cater for between 800 and 1,000 students by the year 2000.

"To this end, we are trying to develop an academic programme which will have a mix of technical and non-technical courses. "That programme will be ready to go-ahead once we get approval for the provision of eight science labs at an overall cost of £4m.

"That figure comes from a feasibility study which examined our existing floor space and the amount of space we need for the college to grown to over 800 students.

"The study was carried by local architectural firm, Sean Taylor & Co., and they reported back to us in September.

"To develop the remaining space which we are leasing from the Western Health Board would bring us to somewhere just under 800 students.

"But there would be serious shortcomings if we just kept within that envelope.

"For instance, the remaining space at our disposal is not suitable for conversion to laboratories because of size, space and safety reasons.

"So we sought and got approval from the Western Health Board to look over the wall, so to speak, into the remaining part of the St. Mary's Hospital building.

"The analysis is contained in Sean Taylor's study. It showed that there were basically two options available to us.

"We could either keep within the envelope and have the shortcomings to which I have referred, or we could have a bigger plan which would involve taking over another large part of the existing hospital building.

"We would not require the entire hospital building for 1,000 students, but we are considering the option of providing student accommodation and space for community groups.

"Staying inside the existing envelope would give us 800 students, but it would not give us the scope for the proposed new educational programmes."

Castlebar RTC has leased 7,000 square metres from the Western Health Board, about 3,000 square metres of which has not yet been refurbished. Mr. Thorn said the cost of refurbishing the 3,000 square metres in question was in the region of £1.5m., and the sum of £600,000, announced last week by Mr. Enda Kenny, T.D., Minister for Trade & Tourism, would only go half way towards developing that particular section of the college.

Stated Mr. Thorn: "I cannot say this often enough. But the reality, from our point of view, is that £4m., and not £1.5m., is required in the long term to provide a facility that will cater for 1,000 students.

"There is so much confusion about this and it is important the public is fully aware of the situation.

"We were asked by the Department of Education to put together a programme and budget for the next five years.

"Very few colleges are asked to do this. We are really being put through the mill. I assume this is right because were are dealing with public money that has to be accounted for.

"What we are proposing over the next four years is no more than what is recognised for other regional colleges throughout the country

"We have submitted a capital budget programme to the Department of Education, and to complete our development plan would involve an investment of £1m. annually up to the year, 2000.

"If we wanted to have between 800 and 1,000 students here in the short term, we could do so by putting in business study courses. But that's not the type of institution people want. "What they want is a balanced programme of education and to do this, there has to be technological subjects, humanity type subjects and a range of other subjects which we are planning.

"If we are to meet our self-imposed targets, it is going to cost £4m. That is the bottom line.

Mr. Thorn made it clear that he was pleased with the monies allocated to date by the Government.

"I am pleased we have got enough of money to keep us going. But if the college is to grow and develop, it needs the full allocation either now or over the next four years.

"I have had detailed discussions with Minister Kenny about the entire matter, and they are off the record at this point.

"I often feel that our problem is interlinked with other problems being experienced in the West of Ireland regarding the lack of funding and the poor record of job creation.

"The West does seem to find it hard to get onto political and other agendas in terms of the provision of resources.

"It is important that every step is taken to prevent this part of the country becoming further marginalised than it is already.

"So it is not just about us finding it hard to reach our targets. It's right across the board.

"If we got £2m. or £4m. now, we would not be in a position to spent it straight away because we would not have the remaining part of St. Mary's Hospital available to us for some time.

"What we need is a commitment that those scales of monies will be made available.

What was his view on the whole political scenario that has built up around the Mayo RTC. Is it helpful? "It is difficult to say. What is very pleasing is that an issue like this is seen to be of public importance.

"We have made a significant contribution to the community regarding the provision of adult and foundation courses.

"I am a public servant and I cannot get involved in the political side of the debate. I cannot come down one way or the other.

"I appreciate everything that everybody is doing for us. What I want to do is to make people aware of the costs of third level education.

"Whatever happens on the community or political front, we at this campus have to keep moving ahead and making do with what we can get.

"We have to make sure our plans are comprehensive, focussed and properly organised. But it would be wrong if I said anything less that £4m. was going

to finish the college." Mr. Thorn explained the degree of investment made to date at the centre. "The total capital investment to date is £1.8m, providing 4,000m square metres of very good accommodation.

"The cost per square metres worked out at about £500, which compared to £1,000 if we started from a green field site. So we are very cost effective in terms of capital expenditure.

"Looked at in terms of cost per student, the cost is £7,000 compared to £12,000 in the university sector. On that basis, investment in Castlebar represented very good value.

"The Education Minister has formed a group to look at campuses throughout Ireland. That group visited our centre last Wednesday.

"What worries me is that those sort of deliberations may be used as a way of saying, sorry, we cannot do anything more for you just yet.

"There is a commitment by the Government to consolidate and develop the centre with the allocation of a further £600,000, but we need to keep the whole thing rolling.

"We can do a very limited amount out of our own resources, but the big expenditure, like the provision of our proposed eight laboratories, must come from Government funding."

Mr. Thorn said the fact Mayo RTC did not have full independent status meant relatively in real terms. "We have an amazing degree of independence and autonomy as it stands. We operate our own budgets here and we set our own priorities. I would argue that Mayo RTC is independent is everything but name.

"The policies and procedures which Galway RTC ask us to implement are things that any sensible institutes do. Ways of hiring people, ways of spending money and so on.

"What is important is that on this campus the buck stops with me and my staff. We decide where we are going as a campus.

"If we went independent in the morning, we would have to appoint a director, a registrar, a financial controller and a make a whole pile of other appointments that an independent college must have.

"Without any increase in the teaching staff or student numbers whatsoever, my estimate is that it would cost us in the region of £500,000 by going independent. It is not a practical proposition and we would need over 3,000 student to justify such expense. There is no way we could generate those kinds of numbers here."

He outlined that third level education was becoming very competitive and Castlebar was hoping to face up to that competition by increasing the proportion of mature students. "We have to find our direction, our own niche, as it were."

Mr. Thorn said the college had enormous potential. "There are a lot of things we have not done yet. Like Summer schools for continential and American students. It is an area we are trying to work on.

"There are also plans to provide the best of sporting facilities, with an all-weather pitch an option being considered.

"The potential is vast. There is no doubt about that."